A walk through memory lane
by Matteo Bossi
We still remember the first time Jimmy Burns came to play in Italy, it was in 2003 at the Castel San Pietro In Blues Festival and so does he, “I remember quite well when I was in Italy with my brother Eddie…it’s been a while”. Back then we had the chance to talk to him for an interview published on issue n. 84 of Il Blues, as he was about to put out his third studio album for Delmark, “Back To The Delta”. We talked to him again now he is back the same label, with a new record, “Full Circle”, accompanied by Chris Foreman’s Soul Message Band. At 82 Jimmy still enjoys making music, singing and performing live and his memory is ever sharp.
This “Full Circle” album is unlike anything you’ve done before, you worked with Chris Foreman Soul Message Band and you cut songs that maybe you don’t perform that often anymore.
It’s true, I very seldom do that stuff. Basically I do a lot of stuff from my Delmark recordings, more so than my R&B days. You know the thing with the R&B stuff is I’ve never performed it live until 2018. But these sessions were great, I really loved working with those guys. It was not a problem, of course we had to rehearse the tunes, but they’re strict professionals so it makes it much easier when you’re trying to accomplish something. I knew them before but I had never performed with them.
In the liner notes you write that “Where Does That Leave Me” had Donny Hathaway arranging and playing piano and the voice of the late Bill Howl’N-Madd Perry.
I only met Donny once in 1970 down at Chess Records, it was him and Philip Upchurch at a session for Little Milton recording a tune called “Many Rivers To Cross” and I was with a friend of mine, Odell Brown. I don’t know if you remember Odell Brown & The Organ-Izers, he ended up playing with Marvin Gaye and he’s one of the co-writers of “Sexual Healing”. But yes, I remember all of those sessions, every one of them, from the very first I did in 1959. But anyway Donnie played on “Where Does That Leave Me” and “Can’t Get Over You” but they never gave credit to him, they pushed somebody else’s name on that. Me and Bill go way back and I talked to him before he passed, he was down in Mississippi. A lot of people don’t realize that he was actually the one who taught Kingfish how to play. Him and I go back fifty years when he was living in Chicago, then he moved back to Mississippi and I used to see him when I go down there. When I first knew him he was Billy Perry. Then he picked up the Howl’N Madd name. As Billy Easton he had a song “I Was A Fool” and he was recording here, he hooked up with Barry Despenza when Barry and Carl Wolfolk went their separate ways.
You have been living in Chicago since 1955, and you’ve been part the doo wop scene with the Medalllionaires, the folk scene and the R&B scene of the Sixties. You met people like Barbara Dane or Curtis Mayfield.
Well, I love all music. I love blues but I’m not a purist…I just like good music and to me there is only one music, good music. God gifted me to do music and I enjoy doing it. I like anything from Frank Sinatra to Muddy Waters, not that I do that, but it’s my range and I like it all. It depends on the song, if I won’t feel it I won’t sing it. You mentioned Barbara Dane, I talked to her in 1960, I was seventeen years old…I remember talking to her at a place in Chicago called The Gate Of Horn, because at that time she did something with Muddy Waters. She just passed away, I think she was ninety something years old. She was a real nice lady and she played acoustic guitar too.
While on the R&B scene you met people like Tyrone Davis, Otis Clay or Harold Burrage. Can you tell us something about all of that?
Oh yes, I knew all of them. Otis I met him in 1965 in Chicago Heights, Illinois, it was a Sunday night and I had a record out. It was me Otis and Tyrone. Otis had a record out at the time, “Tired Of Falling In And Out Of Love” and Tyrone had a song called “You Made Me Suffer” on Four Brothers Records. It was before he got big. And there was another guy, Johnny Sayles he was there too, he was on a show, they were just hanging out. But that’s when I met them. Otis and Tyrone had a day job together. Tyrone Davis back then he was Tyrone The Wonder Boy, he wasn’t using Tyrone Davis, which is his name. The guy who was producing him was a guy by the name of Harold Burrage.
jimmy burns
And what about Curtis Mayfield?
Well, we went to the same school but I didn’t go with him. I first met Curtis when Jerry Butler left the group, because we’re from the same neighborhood. I ended up hanging out at this house and that’s where I met the rest of the Impressions, like Fred Cash. I didn’t realize that Fred was one of the originals, he rejoined the group when Jerry Left, but I didn’t know it at the time. The guy I used to talk all the time was Richard Brooks. Him and his brother Arthur they wrote “For Your Precious Love” with Jerry, Curtis played on it but he didn’t write it. I remember Richard telling me they had a record coming out on ABC and it was “Gypsy Woman”. I used to see him a lot he was a real good brother. He passed away. But then they became a trio, Curtis, Fred and Sam Gooden, but they started out as five. I know Curtis did some auditions and at the time we did a lot of auditions, with my group The Medallionaires too.
With your group you backed up Jimmy Lee Robinson at that time.
Yes, “Twist It Baby”! That’s my group on that…Got a little girl doo… It was on the Bandera label. I think The Impressions ended up on Bandera after Vee-Jay but they had some problem and did another recording contract. They recorded a lot of stuff and I remember when Curtis started to be the lead singer, the last thing with Jerry was “At The County Fair”.
You’ve said that seeing Billy Branch or Lurrie Bell ignited your will to play the blues, how and when adid that happen?
You’re absolutely right! It was 1978, Willie Dixon took my nephew Larry Taylor, Demetria Taylor’s older brother, Freddie Dixon, Lurrie Bell and Billy Branch to Berlin for a gig called Next Generation Of The Blues. When they came back to Chicago we were hanging out and I we went to see Billy Branch, he was a young guy and I was amazed at him playing blues like that, it was quite was exceptional at the time. And Billy is still a good friend of mine and he’s now one of the ambassadors of the blues. He even worked with my brother Eddie and Little Joe Blue in Europe. When I heard them play… I remember I told that to my wife, they were playing Chicago blues and I love Chicago blues, Muddy Waters, Little Walter, Jimmy Rogers…They were doing stuff like “Can’t Hold Out Much Longer” o “Crazy About You Baby”, I still love that, it’s some of my favorite music.
It’s been nearly 30 years since your first album on Delmark, “Leaving Here Walking”, came out. You worked a lot with Rockin Johnny Burgin in those days.
Oh yes it was in the Nineties, down at the Smoke Daddy, they invited me and it was not about the money, because at the time I was making maybe a thousand dollars a week with my job. I think they gave us twenty dollars plus food and drink but I didn’t care since I was doing it for the music. It turned out good and that’s why I ended up with Delmark. Bob (Koester) came down, Scott Dirks told him about us. When we recorded “Leaving Here Walking” I had years of accumulation of original songs. We had a good band.
Where you friends with Jimmy Johnson?
Oh Jimmy I first heard him in 1964 at the time I had a record out called “Give Her To Me”, at a place in Maxwell Street. have been a fan of Jimmy Johnson ever since I heard him because he was always polished. When I heard him play blues in the Eighties I was surprised, he was pretty much R&B when I first heard him, I remember him he was singing a tune by William Bell that was popluar at the time, “Any Other Way”. He was real sharp. And I got to know him, he was quite a guy.
When did you start to play with your late brother Eddie? I was lucky enough to see you together in Italy in 2003, you had recorded together “Snake Eyes” a couple of years earlier.
Let me explain something to you. I’m the youngest and Eddie was the oldest, he was fifteen years older than me. We were not raised together, even if we have the same mother and father. My grandmother raised him, just like with my baby sister Rosie. I didn’t really get to know good Eddie until later on. Seventy years ago we came to Chicago, me, my sister, my stepfather and my mom. In 1962 he was the one who introduced me to Albert King, it was Little Milton and his company in East St. Louis called Bobbin…Milton had “Lonely Man” and Albert “Don’t Throw Your Love On Me So Strong”. I met them because they were doing things for Big Bill Hill on the West Side of Chicago. When Eddie and I finally had a chance to do something together it was in 1998 or ’99 in Sweden with a polish guy that became a naturalized canadian citizen up in Toronto. And then we went to Japan, it was my first trip to Japan. But we didn’t do a lot. Sometimes I would sit in when I would visit him in Detroit, he played a lot up there. I actually got to know him good starting in 1971 when we traveled on vacation to see him, me and my family, my wife and my kids. Because I wanted my kids to know their cousins. So that’s how we ended up being closer.
Eddie and Jimmy Burns Castel San Pietro In Blues 2003 ph Matteo Bossi
What about the “Snake Eyes” album?
Oh I remember it quite well, because it was the exact same time of 9/11. I never will forget. We were supposed to come in on Monday but when that happened they canceled the session and we did it on Tuesday. Eddie was staying at my house with his wife. I remember that my sister in law and my wife Dorothy they were watching the TV and they didn’t think it was real at first.
You sing two numbers, “Beast Of Burden” and “Dead Flowers” on Chicago Plays The Stones. What do you remember about that project?
Oh that was Larry Skoller’s project, Matthew Skoller’s brother. I did two of the Stones tunes and I think John Primer and myself were the only one who did two tunes. Billy Branch was on that record and Keith Richards was on guitar on one of the tunes. You know I met even Jeff Beck, it was in 1965, we were on the same show.
You did some touring in Europe over the years with italian guitarist Luca Giordano and you also worked with Dave Herrero, what are some of your memories about those experiences?
I played with Luca a lot in Spain and Italy, he used to come here with Quique Gomez out of Madrid. I talked to him not long ago, he plays a lot down there in Brazil, he’s a great guitarist. I work a lot with Dave too, later on this month we will be opening for ZZ Top. I see Dave all the time we get together for lunch usually down in Chinatown. We go way back, he remembers my wife and I know his brother and his girlfriend, I even met his mom, they would come over to my house when I have barbecue, Christmas or Thanksgiving or stuff like that…the year before last, me, Dave with my niece Demetria we went down to Mexico City.
It surely is a learning experience for them to play with you.
Oh I never think about people learning from me, I just try to do what I’m supposed to be doing…keep my shit right! I’ve never looked at it that way, but if it is so it’s a big compliment.
Jimmy Burns Kingston Mines foto Philippe Prétet
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